DATE	SUBJECT    (Previous Archive: Mar-02) Return to Archives Page
04/30	sounds like several fires in sw: the Ryan fire, the reeves fire, the penasco fire, plus at least 1 more fire. two type 1 teams ordered -- Bates and Humphrey .... we're off to the races folks doc
04/30	Jobs page, Wildland Firefighter Job Series 0462 and 0455 Pages are updated. Ab.
04/30	Tucker Don't feel so bad about not being hired right away. I'm going to be a rif'd (fired due to down sizing) fed employee and I can't get hired either. You should try looking at State level firefighting. Try all the west coast states and start submitting applications. Don't loose hope! Try and get your red card if you can. Keep your head up! Grunt82abn If you go to the Links Page, then to State Agency, you can work your way through state fire employment. Ab.
04/30	ryan fire 100 structures threatened its moving sounds like another ripper TT
04/30	Has anybody heard about the new product expected out sometime this year from the pharmaceutical companies? It should have a tremendous impact on the wildland fire community. Its called Eegonot. Manufacturers claim that when taken prior to assignment to an incident it will render invisible any agency patch and deflate, in the early stages, any agency chest puffing providing for a truly unified non-judgmental team effort. No longer should we hear "Thats not the way "WE" do it". Instead all parties will work together to do what ever is most safe and effective to control the incident. Not only does this product affect the user, but it has a cascade effect between the user and anyone that comes in verbal contact with the user by modifying physiological attitudes that provide for recognition of the fact that everyone has an important role to play, from initial attack forces right on down to the guy that cleans the porta potties. This product also allows the user to understand that each suppression unit is made up of a team of individuals and consequently each unit is somewhat unique. Meaning that even with units of the same type, regardless of the agency, they are not all the same. Some are great, some are not so great and as always a few are pathetic, it just depends on the individuals that make up that unit and a multitude of other factors. --dingdingdingdingding---dingdingdingding---dingdingdingding ...wha???shi..., my alarm...I musta been dreamin. Pulaski
04/30	Tucker, There Is Nothing Wrong With Working For A Contractor. Just Watch Out Who You Work For. Though Most Are Good, There Are A Few Out there That Aren't Worth the Paper Their Contract Is Written On. (The Employment Office Tried To Get Me To Work With One And I Would rather The World Burned Down Than Work For Them.) How Ever, A Couple Of Good Ones Where You're At Are <snip and forwarded> Just Because You Didn't Get With The Government This Year, Go Private, And At least You Can Get Some Experience For Next Time. Coyote (F.S.E.)
04/30	JVH, Your concerns about ATV helmets and fire are an issue. The National Forests in Texas has this spring sent a request to the San Dimas Research Center to develop an all inclusive helmet for riding and fighting fire. Right now you have to have a ATV helmet for riding, which is hot, limits communications and limits vision. Once off the ATV you must switch to a hardhat that meets standards for firefighting. We have asked them to develop a prototype helmet that will serve both purposes - meets stds for firefighting, improves vision, communications and vents heat buildup. Don't expect anything soon but will keep the board posted. rangerjim
04/30	JJ, What I was trying to say about getting hired as a wildland fire fighter is that the job is much more attainable to someone trying to break into the field than becoming a structural fire fighter would be. In California, where i am from, it takes several years to become a city fire fighter. In comparison, it only takes a matter of months to get a job as a wildland fire fighter. All you need is a Red Card and a heartbeat. But getting the job and keeping it are two different matters. Wildfire is incredibly hard work- it requires dedication, tenacity, and a lot of insomnia. Working as a city fire fighter is different altogether- structure fires last hours rather than days or weeks. You work 10 days a month instead of 5+ days a week. And you make a lot more money and deal with a lot more PR issues. Yes, you have to be smart and fit and upstanding to do both jobs, but the jobs are not the same. The way you learn how to be a wildland fire fighter is by going on fires. There is no substitute for this training. You can spend a year or two at junior college going to a structural fire fighting academy. You cannot do this for wildfire. The paradigm of wildfire suppression training has been hands on. S-130 & 190 teach the very basics of fire behavior & weather. They do not teach you how to fight fire. The only people who can teach you how to fight wildfire are your supervisors and co-workers, which typically means you learn by someone else's example. As for the distinction between seasonal and career firefighters, well, i don't really see any appreciable one. Everyone has to be in good shape and have their act together, period. But if you want to try out wildfire for a summer you can, and you are not bound by any commitment to take the job again the following summer. This means that a certain small percentage seasonals will not be very serious about fire fighting, which is unfortunate and a pain in the ass, but nonetheless true. But again, when we're on the fireline we all breathe the same smoke, eat the same bad food, and sleep on the same hard ground- so as long as you pull your own weight and act responsibly and safely, it doesn't matter. MM
04/30	"Zimm" wanted info on the strategy, tactics and planning of Demob: In my opinion, after 30+ seasons doing wildfire operations in more than 20 States, I'm convinced that a knowledgeable Demob Unit Leader is critical to maintaining morale and efficiency! among the troops on the fire! While I 'ain't one", I think that I can recognize a good one when I see one: they think way ahead, talk constantly with OPS and Plans, and apply a large dose of common sense to the process! {I can recommend a real experienced Demob UL for Zimm......one-on-one, off the main page} Mollysboy
04/30	CDFMike, Type 1 Handcrew and you like it when IHC Crew's back you up.... HAHAHA you're kidding right. An-R5er
04/30	hi ab well ive been trying my hardest to get hired on in the r-6 region (central oregon area) but it seems as though ive been passed over.. now it seems that the only option is to either go private or not go at all.. is there anybody out there who can tell me if this is a good idea.. or should i just volunteer structural this year and wait for next season?? what is the deal with marking crews.. they tell me i can work over time fires on the weekend?? whats what?? tucker (used to be in Korea.. now in the grand ole states again)
04/30	Ab, I have a question about ATV helmets used for wildlife and prescribed fires. What are the current USFWS regulations about them? Do they have the same standards as the Forest Service? My concerns about regular atv helmets include: 1. heat stress due to ambient temperatures when using atv helmets while running the line; 2. lack of radio communication with full helmets; 3. possible combustion of helmet materials including the chin strap and lining; 4. lack of suitable design to allow accessories such as nomex and full face shields during extreme heat. What do you know about this subject? Can you email me with some suggestions that will meet NFPA standards as well as USFWS standards. Thank you JVH
04/29	I am looking for some information regarding the strategic & tactics & planning of demobilization or who might have that kind of info. Help is very appreciated. Zimm Hanford Fire Department
04/29	Bustin as@ in Colo. Pegged me right. Pat is here (duty station wise) but somewhere in MO? on a Helitack detail. ...... BBB. Oh yeah ..Lars sezs ..???????
04/29	From Firescribe, an article on the Snaking Fire: Park County conditions stun firefighters
04/29	MM, <snip> It's great, you make a few phone calls, sound enthusiastic, fill out a few applications- and bamn, you're a firefighter. <snip> I am not a firefighter, but I've been reading this site for some while now and I've learned there is a bit more to the business than you suggest. Why would you want to give the wrong impression to individuals who might consider this profession? Are seasonals less professional than career firefighters? Is it okay to be less educated as a seasonal? Does that keep everybody safe whether they get to the fire by dropping in or hiking? I'm assuming you had a thought or two about mentioning being trained but you missed putting them in your post. JJ
04/29	Hello there I just wanted to say what a great site. I have one question. My shoulder pad for my saw recently tore apart and I am seeking a replacement. That should be easy but I am having no luck whatsoever. If anyone could point me to a website or someone willing to sell one, I would be much obliged. You can reach me at JLB2400@hotmail.com I would really appreciate anyone who can help me. Justin
04/29	Ab- I don't know if this counts, 'cause its not a exclusive fire book, but Sebastian Junger's book "Fire" is an excellent read. only the first two chapters are about wildfires, but they are very good, if brief, descriptions of life on the fireline. any book that includes the line that "the government throws money at a fire until the weather changes" is pretty dialed into to the thoughts/feelings of those who chase smokes all summer. one chapter deals with the south canyon fire, and while i disagree with some of the statements made, it is nonetheless a fine piece. I would give the chapters dealing with fire 4 chainsaws. (and the rest of the book is fantastic also). JerseyBoy We'll take a look. Ab.
04/29	Plethora of Book reviews: Wildfire Loose: The Week Maine Burned History Buffs pay attention to this one! Fact by fact recounts of fires in southern, central, and down east Maine make this work somewhat patience testing to read. If you are interested in the history of Maine and it's wildland fires, this book is a great source of information. If you're looking for entertainment...bump by. 2 saws Paddlefire Two Man Stick This recounting of how a young east-coast man broke into the art of flinging oneself out of a perfectly good airplane is entertaining and informative. Recounting early firefighting efforts, the author does a great job setting the scene for the reader, and leading him up and down the Idaho 4 Saws Mountains. Paddlefire Fire Lookouts of Oregon and Washington Well, I used this book to look into the history and information available for the Goldbug (I think that was it, on the Willamette NF, Detriot RD) Lookout. A small wooden Lookout with a road almost all the way to it. Directions were good, although renovation was just beginning the summer I visited it. This book was useful. 4 saws Paddlefire Whew...I've read a few more, but will need to brush up on the Specifics before I write anything. Also- Stephen Pyne's Fire's of 1910 book is not listed. I'm almost through it, I'll put in my thoughts once I'm finished. On another note, gearing up for the season. Running, pushups, situps, pullups. Boy winter was tough. Have a good season all. Paddlefire Thanks from Ab, and, I'm sure, thanks from future potential readers. Go to the Book Page and from there to Reviews if you're looking for a good book. Buy 'em from Amazon and we get a small cut that helps pay the bills. Ab.
04/29	HooBoy!! Coyote was certainly right to call Fedfire on his remark about Hotshots ("Those are inmates you know"). We who run California's Type 1 Inmate-Firefighter Handcrews take extreme exception to being confused with Hotshots. The Shots are good, and we like to have them up on the line with us, backing us up, but what was Fedfire thinking? CDFMike from Arroyo Grande
04/28	Fedfire, I was just curious as to how things are panning out at your new department. I, too, made the transition from the FS to a DoD fire department and I 've been there for a year now. I think the only reason last summer was bearable was because it was pretty slow. I think that having a DoD firefighter job is a good one but it is very slow and the scenery never changes. Pay was a big reason for me leaving the FS, but I will tell you this, going to all those fires and working with some great people made for memorable times. I wonder sometimes why I even left. I know "pavement queens" serve their purpose just as all FS resources do, but trust me, once wildland gets in your blood, it stays there. Thanks, Feeling The Twitch
04/28	Fedfire-- What Did You Mean When You Said "(Those Are Inmates You Know.)"? Who Hotshots? I Know Cali Has Type I Inmate Crew's. However I Do Believe If You're Talking Hotshot's, The Flame-N-Go Was The Only IHC In The Country. But Are Now A Type II Crew, Due To An Incident Where They Lost A Couple Of Members -- And Since They Were Inmates, Their Family's Didn't Get The Benefits That F.S. Crew's Receive. I May Be Wrong, But I Don't Think That There Are Any More Actual Inmate IHC's. Coyote
04/28	"I am sad to see the "us vs. them" mentality rise to the surface again (engines vs. hotshots and smokejumpers). I don't think that it adds to anything positive, and it indicates a lack of professionalism. Engines, shot crews, and jumpers all are valuable resources with unique missions. All of them see interesting fires, and all of them sit around at times." Don't disagree with you on the value of bashing each other but it is obvious that the agencies along with the public place importance on Smokejumpers, Helitack, Hotshots (those are inmates you know) and finally engines (usually big red pavement queens and half dressed guys in structure turnouts) in that order, while the work load is for the most part organized in the reverse. I generally try to stay out of these arguments as being unproductive since we all have our strengths and weaknesses. But as an engineslug, I know I get really tired of hearing how we have the easiest job. Wildland engines are the back bone of IA forces but still have no national standard, unlike IHC and Helitack and we have many more requirements to perform our job (EMS, SCBA, Hazmat) with less support, and for some odd reason usually get stuck with facilities as a 6, 7 or 8 while 9's just run their crews. Go check out the new USFS fire and aviation website, people in fire, engines don't even get a coming soon space like Type 2 crews, I pointed this out to the webmasters and even wrote up a nice description for engines following the outline of the SJ, HT and IHC descriptions which I was thanked for but that was over a year ago and engines still don't have a space. So you have to give us engineslugs a little space to fuss otherwise we wouldn't even know we exist. You know if you're nice to an engineslug they might even let you trade them for a T-shirt (cash has been known to work too). Enough of that This is going to be my first summer without the USFS in many years, looks like I'm going to miss a busy one too :( I'm already starting to twitch. When does MEL start next year? There was also talk about extending the Socal retention pay to some of the other R5 Forests earlier this year anyone know whats going on with that? Wouldn't take much to pry me off my pavement queen if I didn't have to go back to a diet of ramon noodles every winter. Fedfire
04/28	Ab, This is in answer to "Food for Thought" and for ALL WILDLAND FIREFIGHTERS… Let's make this information a little more accessible so folks can read it more easily without going through all the CFRs, USCs, pages and hoops. Here's the skinny before it gets out of hand.. If wildland firefighters were PROPERLY CLASSIFIED as Firefighters, all of the issues described would be fixed immediately. Currently under TITLE 5.. Wildland Firefighters ARE NOT CLASSIFIED AS FIRE PROTECTION (Series 0081). (For those who do not know, they are Series 462 and 455, Forestry and Range Technicians, respectively.) IAFF DoD firefighters have already fought the BATTLE to get Title 5 amended as it is. It's time for wildland firefighters to unite and do the same…. to be properly classified under the Fire Protection (0081) series. READ ON for the full information. Then... Join the Federal Wildland Fire Service Association (FWFSA) and fix these problems. ………… http://www.fwfsa.org SoCalCapt
04/28	Two things, Ab... First, let there be no more mention of IHC/Jumpers/Engine rivalries... We all do different jobs in different roles, with the same end in mind. As the state equiv. of an Engine Captain, yeah, I can put out a lot of fire. However, some the the wildest fire behavior I've seen personally was in support of an IHC. New to me, routine business for them. Friendly rivalries in and around the district are good builders of esprit de corps; but for an Engine Capt, IHC Supt./Crew Boss, or Lead Jumper to instill in their crew that the way they fight fire is superior to all others in all manners is downright arrogant, and probably fosters an unsafe attitude and certainly an environment without the coveted "Mutual Respect of Differences" the HR officers on the teams never fail to mention. Second, the CRT/Lunch issue... I can't count the # of times I've been told to add a 1/2 hour and claim a lunch, even when "lunch" consisted of a sandwich in one hand and the nozzle in the other. Other times I've written "Initial Attack, no lunch taken" or some similar disclaimer. Often times I hear "We (the overhead/team/mgmt.) will get in trouble if you guys don't show a lunch and work too many hours." Length of shifts/rest periods is another matter entirely. I'm sure the meal break answer lies beyond us line folks, but I'd sure like to hear it. That's the end of my diatribe (for today). Stay Safe, gang. -FireBill
04/28	I was reading on the Nova Website about Fire Wars and I was reading I saw the name of someone I knew. The director of photography, Jon Else, is a professor at the UC Berkeley Graduate School of Journalism, where I am studying. Big surprise. I'm going to go talk with him on Monday about doing a documentary on the Alaska Jumpers. I've wanted to be a jumper even since I got into this business, and i think that it would be great to share that life with a public that really doesn't know jack about it. Except for working last season in Montana, I have always lived in urban centers. And in those urban centers, no one knows anything about what we do. "You mean you can be a fire fighter as a summer job?" People are clueless, totally clueless. Now, I know that the jumpers get a disproportionate amount of attention when it comes to the press, but I think that the dream of becoming a jumper is what gets a lot of people into this business. Now, if they ever want to leave their engine again after their first day on a handcrew is another story. But I think that in this world there's not a lot of options for young people growing up who don't want to do the whole 9 to 5 thing. Where I'm from, there's a helluva lot of people doomed to Office Space & Dilbert type lives. Deviation from that norm requires a whole helluva lot of effort, outside of seasonal fire fighting and a few other select professions. It's great, you make a few phone calls, sound enthusiastic, fill out a few applications- and bamn, you're a firefighter. Compare that with city firefighting- you gotta spend several years on wait lists, doing interviews, not fighting fires and when you do get the job, you see a lot less fire than you do in the wild. We got a sweet deal going here folks! I think that kids should be able to dream of jumping out of airplanes or rappelling out of helicopters or just plain fighting fire as a real way they could spend their lives. That's what I want to do- expand people's vision, let them know that they too can do this stuff. Because if you've ever been on a fire you know that you don't have to be an Olympic athlete to do this work, but you just need the will to press on, no matter how tired or how hungry or how sore you are. This is hard work.. When you're really busting ass, it's just different degrees of misery separating you and the next guy. It's like the military- anyone can do it physically, but the mental part is what will get you. On a related note, I am trying to get together a website for the University of California that actually teaches people how to get a wildfire job. The site would be geared to students looking for summer jobs. If you have information or suggestions email me at Mireles@uclink.berkeley.edu. I don't know how I'd feed myself without this job- what a life! All praise to Big Ernie. MM Ab bites lip, holding back reply...
04/28	Re: Hellroaring, Life and Times of a Fire Bum Ran across this book in a used book store. It was one heck of a find. Peter Leschak did a great job of outlining what it takes to go from volunteer/AD firefighter to a Gov't paid working bum. I found that I could relate to a lot of the stories and chuckled time after time thinking of situations I have been in that have been very similar. I recommend reading! 3.5 saws Paddlefire Thanks, I put your review on the Book Review page. Ab.
04/28	Hey AB, Do you have any info on fire jobs in South Carolina including the Savannah River Institute??? Also I did a season on the Shasta-Trinity Forest 13 years ago does that help? I was 18 then but still in good shape! Thanks JohnV Anyone answer John's question? Hmmmm, Shasta T, well, we mighta crossed paths. Ab.
04/27	Hello All, I noticed that Hellroaring, Life and Times of a Fire Bum is on the FireBooks page and no one has reviewed it. Has anyone read it? Is it worth the money? How many saws? Good to see Seasons of Fire got reviewed. I like that book. Tahoe Terrie Readers, please browse through the books list again to see if you could contribute a review to one of the books that doesn't yet have one. O'course you musta read it first. Ab.
04/27	661 short timer- thanks for relayin the message. I been busy and cant find his #, are you workin at Lacroix? if so does PAT still work there? I was there last summer and just lookin for some of those folks, 661 short timer is this 3B..burn boss barton? bustin as@ in colo............... bustin, You in firecamp? Roger Dodger Over'n'Out. Ab.
04/27	Power point anyone? http://esf.uvm.edu/sirippt/powerpt.html Hickman
04/27	bustin as@ in Colo.-- I relayed the message to Lars L. Now I need to give the ol' feller cumputer lessons. 661 short timer.
04/27	Well folks I thought I would toss out a new can of worms for everyone to kick around for a while. I know many of you have been in the situation where you skip a meal break and eat while driving to the scene, walking up the line etc. and did not take your leisurely half hour meal period. The Interagency Incident Business Management Handbook, (IIBMH), Section 12.6, which covers meal periods states, “Compensable meal periods are the exception not the rule.”. A long list of conditions follow that first statement that must be met before you can be paid for the missed meal break. When it comes time to turn in the CTR you may be asked by the time unit to supply additional documentation verifying that you did not take a meal break. How many use the old tried and true method of falsifying a govt. document by adding an extra half hour on to the end of the day to cover the missed meal period and avoid the hassle of having to do the additional justifications? My point and/or question is why are we required to show a meal break at all? It appears to me that The Code of Federal Regulations, (CFR), is quite clear on this topic, it avoids all those wiggle room words like may or can and instead says that the tour of duty SHALL include all the time on duty including meal breaks when engaged in fire protection or law enforcement activities. 5 CFR 551.541 Employees engaged in fire protection activities or law enforcement activities. b) The "tour of duty" of an employee engaged in these activities shall include all time the employee is on duty. Meal periods and sleep periods are included in the tour of duty except as otherwise provided in §§ 551.411(c) and 551.432(b) of this part. 5 CFR 551.411 Workday (c) Bona fide meal periods shall not be considered hours of work, except for employees engaged in fire protection or law enforcement activities who receive compensation for overtime hours of work under 5 U.S.C. 5545(c) (1) or (2). However, for employees engaged in fire protection or law enforcement activities who have periods of duty of more than 24 hours, meal periods may be excluded from hours of work by agreement between the employer and the employee. 5 CFR 551.432 covers sleep time and meal breaks on normal tours of duty greater than 24 hours. 5 U.S.C. 5545(c) (1) & (2) covers night, standby, irregular, and hazardous duty differential. No where in these rules, regulations, and laws did I see anything like the requirements of the IIBM handbook, the law simply says that if you are engaged in firefighting activities meal breaks are included in your tour of duty and you get paid for them. Are cutting line, running an engine, etc. firefighting activities? What about all the support positions in fire camp, dispatch etc.? If they are why are all the requirements in IIBM 12.6 in place? Hopefully some wiser heads than mine can shine some light on this topic and explain why agency polices are not in accordance with the laws in place. Call me Food for Thought But don’t call me Late for Dinner
04/27	I am sad to see the "us vs. them" mentality rise to the surface again (engines vs. hotshots and smokejumpers). I don't think that it adds to anything positive, and it indicates a lack of professionalism. Engines, shot crews, and jumpers all are valuable resources with unique missions. All of them see interesting fires, and all of them sit around at times. 6
04/27	Hey Does anyone know if and when the third round for hiring for the FS is going to happen? Also, Do you know when we as applicants should hear something? Riley Look at the MELmadness-2002. Scroll down to Permanent Positions then critical dates and look for Round 3. Those dates also work for temp hiring as I understand it. Ab.
04/27	Hello Ab. and all Cap't Pete: You said "most any engine captain could tell the world how to put a wildland fire OUT, much better than most hotshots or smokejumpers" I think that maybe an eng capt can but, I'm an ex Hotshot, and now I'm running engines and you know what? I"d rather see the footage of the Shots!!!!!!! I've experienced more erratic fire behavior while on a hand crew and had to deal with it, than with the engine. With the engine you can just leave. Just as scary though. Both would provide great footage. Bottom line, just remember L.C.E.S. Woodsman
04/27	Ab, As several have stated, the NOVA program is set to air May 7. I understand that we have a good relationship with NOVA. They linked to us and we've linked to them on theysaid. I looked at their link and it looks awesome except... they state the South Canyon Fire was the "worst wildland firefighting disaster in history". I have some exceptions: 1910 - "The Big Blow" ID, 72 firefighters killed, 7 large crews overrun by fire 1933 - Griffith Park CA, 25 firefighters killed, 128 injured 1937 - Blackwater WY, 15 firefighters killed ?? 1930-1940's or 50's - 20+ Marines killed while sleeping on a fire on the Cleveland NF... More info is still needed to confirm... possibly the "Tragedy Springs" area... i cant find my notes on the old source Maybe they should have put "recent history." SoCalCapt
04/27	Skyeblue: First thing- if you get hired as a first year FF with no experience through a Federal Agency, you will be sent to Fire Training (lasts about a week) to get your red card. You will be paid for this. But, if you are interested in bettering your chances for a job, go for the redcard. A redcard is usually good until the end of the calandar year it was issued, (or it may be 1 full year from the date it was issued, ANYONE ELSE KNOW THIS?????). The courses you take to get the red card will help you out in the long run though. S-190, S-130, and I-100 are the 3 basics for red carding. Once you receive your card you will be a FFT2 or Firefighter type 2. This is the basic entry level position, but you will have your foot in the door. At the training you will probably meet local fire managers and fire officers who may still be looking to hire for this season (nothing is final in the fire world, people who took jobs may end up going somewhere else) or they may be able to direct you toward a crew that works on call. Anyway you look at it, if you can afford the class it will help you. Well, those are my 2 pennies. paddlefire
04/26	Hey Ab and All, Glad to see the wlf link on the pbs resources links. BUT. . .could it be that most any engine captain could tell the world how to put a wildland fire OUT, much better than most hotshots or smokejumpers? I know, it's just not as glamorous, what with jumping out of airplanes or hiking five miles to the fireline. I still say, as I've said here before. . .stick a camera crew with a hot wildlandfire engine crew for a season and they'd do much less sitting around and have a lot more HOT footage and action for the viewers. Ok, I'm done. Again. Cap't Pete
04/26	Ab, Good morning. Congratulations on the new record on unique hits. I enjoy this site more that any on the web. I find it both informative and entertaining. Keep up the great work and thanks. I just checked out the NOVA site for Fire Wars now that it is open. It looks like it will be an interesting show. They have a link with a nice blurb about wildlandfire.com so expect the hits to keep increasing. Be sure to check out the picture of the polar bear at a fire. That's something you don't see everyday. Shep
04/26	Hey Ab! You ever been a smokejumper??? <smerk> Check this out. We're on the resources list for the NOVA site. www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/fire/resources.html I see that K's article about how to be a firefighter is up there too. Are we gettin' to be main stream or what? Ab, do we have to watch our language? <wide eyes><little madonna smile> OFG> I would like to see that movie- Did the hero look good because he (she??!! if they're being PC) broke every safety rule in the book? Isn't that the way hollywood does it? SCC> and Tiny> the packages are in the mail. Thanks! Skye> I was told when I finished my training for FF1 that it would be good for two years and then I'd probably have to retrain if I hadn't gotten a job (and a redcard issued) before then. This was an interagency ROP training but was headed up by CDF, so it's CA standards. Don't know if there are other time standards for FF1 training in other states. Some certs like the EMT may last for longer before being viewed as outdated. Anyone know? Study your butt off on everything you can get into. This new organization (in CA at least) is heavy on getting training and the college credit for it. On another note. It was pretty funny to have you studying while we're all chattin' the other night -- like some teenager hanging out on the fringes while the oldsters talk to each other and to the youngsters who are asking questions... Mellie Never been one. Never wanted to. Even when I could'a. Give me fire and smoke and dirt and a crew bumpin' up. Ab.
04/26	Wow Everyone, we had 4941 unique visitors yesterday, a new record, and looks like we're going to exceed 100,000 unique visitors again for the month. Ab.
04/26	Ab, I've just completed reading alot of the Standards for Fire and Aviation Operations 2002. I was interested to learn that the original document came from the OSHA citations from the South Canyon Fire. It appears as though the re-write came only after the 30 Mile Fire. The interagency cover letter specifically states that it meets action item 17 of the 30 Mile Prevention Action Plan. Hate to say it but the whole document smells of crisis management following policy failures. After the Dude Fire, a very knowledgeable HS supt. came up with a great idea... He understood the answer wasn't adding layers to the 10 Standard Fire Orders and 18 Situations.. but enforcing them and recognizing the CRITICAL items. He came up with LCES (Lookouts, Communication, Escape Routes and Safety Zones).. It wasnt meant to do away with the 10 and/or 18... just pull them together so ALL firefighters could be safer. I am a firm believer that the 10 & 18, and LCES work perfectly fine when used in conjunction with experienced leaders. Adding additional layers of responsibilities and documentation isn't the answer. THE ANSWER IS FOR FIRE MANAGEMENT TO HOLD THEIR FOLKS ACCOUNTABLE. Making the IC's personally accountable for ensuring the 10 and 18 are adhered to is not achievable and will probably someday result in another OSHA citation for not ensuring Agency Policies were adhered to. We need to make SURE each crew or engine boss is FULLY ACCOUNTABLE for their operations. We need to make sure EACH firefighter (all of us) understands and follows the 10 Standards and that each firefighter recognizes the WARNING signs given by the 18 Situations. Before we engage, we MUST make sure that LCES is in place. Rogue Rivers
04/26	Another announcement came in. Don't forget that Fire Wars, the NOVA special is coming up on May 7 on PBS. Details. Ab.
04/26	I have the opportunity to take a 5 day class up in Lake Tahoe through the local community college that, when it is all done, I get my Red Card. As it looks that I am not getting on anywhere this season, I want to get all the training I can get my hands on this summer and fall (registered to get my EMT etc.). Is it worth it to spend the time and money on this class and how long is a Red Card good for? Skyeblue
04/25	Someone sent in the final draft of the Long-Range Fire Risk Assessment Southwest Geographic Area 2002 Fire Season (23 pp in doc format). Topics include Current Situation, Weather and Climate, Fuels and Fire Behavior (Fine Fuels, Pinyon - Juniper, Coniferous Forest) Fire Behavior, Management Implications, Season Termination Events. It has some fine descriptive maps and illustrations. It begins "Fire management has significant concerns about the severity of the 2002 fire season and the implications as the season progresses. These concerns include potential for extreme fire behavior, fire fighter safety, and risk to communities, public expectations, to list a few." Creators are Chuck Vickery, Fred Schoeffler, Dean Clark, Ron Moody, Roberta Bartlette, Chuck McHugh, and Rich Woolley of the USFS and NPS. If anyone would like to read it, let me know and I'll e-mail it to you. Ab.
04/25	From Firescribe: A small NM fire on the Mescalero Apache Indian Reservation. www.borderlandnews.com Daily Fire Behavior Outlook Map: www.fs.fed.us/r3/fire/outlooks/daily/SWAdaily.gif Large Wildland Fire Location Map: www.fs.fed.us/r3/fire/swa-fire.htm Fuel Moisture Maps: 10 hour 100 hour 1000 hour ~>~>~>~>~>~>~>~>~>~>~>~>~>~>~~~~~~~~~~~ Ab note: Here's a good place to check the R3 Sit Report and Morning Report, etc. www.fs.fed.us/r3/fire/ The National Sit Report is up on a daily basis. You can find a link to it link on our Links Page under news and reports. It appears that you need to access the pdf file for the current day's report. Other ways to find fed info on current fires from our links page is to go to the Situation Reports by Geographic Areas also under the news and reports. For example, to find the r3/fire/ link above, you can choose Southwest Area Communication Center from that GACCs page. Ab.
04/25	Hello all -- Qualifications system guide for wildland and prescribed fire (310-1) can also be found on the web. Don't need to order hard copy from NIFC to answer many of the questions. This particular publication can be found at www.nwcg.gov/pms/docs/310-1new.pdf There are alot of other very useful publications, task books, forms, etc. also available at this site for downloading -- check it out! www.nwcg.gov -- then click on "publications" in the upper right hand of the home page. Cache Queen Ab didn't link to to the large .pdf file. Those interested will have to cut and paste the url into the location line of their browser.
04/25	http://web.wt.net/~jagski/fire.html HA This is just too funny...neighboor pissed off at his neighboor for burning. JJ Thanks JJ, the wonders of the internet. Forest fire, eh? Ab.
04/25	Parts of southern Utah were declared a drought emergency yesterday, expect more to follow. And the snowpack is mostly gone. We're in for a "good" year! Utah County Firedog
04/25	Update of Snaking Fire This is what they are saying this morning. between 2000-2400 acres. Evacuated town of Bailey yesterday for a time but let people return later. Suspect a teen smoking near high school might have started it. 200 FF arriving today with 150 here already. 30 fire engines. 5 air planes with 3 more in today. 4 helos with 4 more today. Winds are down here at work this morning. I couldn't see any large smoke clouds. But very smoky looking south from here at work. I see 3 planes at Jeffco airport. I work a mile from it and can see them coming and going at lunch when I go outside. I enjoy watching them, but wish they didn't have to be here. But sounds like I will get to see them more then I want this summer. Thanks to the FF and the Type One team for being here and helping save what they can. CAFSman
04/25	Mellie, If you've changed your mind and want the video, give me an address. No need to return it. Share the pain. Nah! We take ourselves to serious. Who wants all movies to be documentaries. Do we believe that "City Slickers" offended ranch hands? Does "Armegeddon" dis-respect real astronauts? Is "Casablanca" hurtful to those real participants in the WWII underground? Truth? My favorite movies include John Wayne's "Big Jake", and for firefighting....."Always". Thirty years of fire and I still believe that the end of the rainbow holds a firecamp with cold beer, live band, John Goodman being excellent in every scene he is in, and (best of all) Holly Hunter sans undergarments in a white dress. OFG
04/25	NorCal Tom, Yes, others of us are concerned for the same reasons you state. The CIIMT meetings are next week. Maybe this issue will be discussed. How do we have accountability for following the Fire Orders when they are so subjective? Kent Connaughton (Dep R5 Forester on the 30-mi investigation team) said at the Division Chiefs Meeting that he feared another 30 mile tragedy was inevitable sooner or later because of the nature of firefighting regardless of how safe we try to make it. Accountabilities are important, but can they be legislated like this Standards for Operations, 2002 document? SoCal TH
04/25	For "RW in North Carolina": Safety Officer 2 (SOF2) only requires a "Moderate" on the Work Capacity Test under ICS 310-1, but you must be a fully qualified Division Supervisor (DIVS) before you can initiate the Task Book and eventually "be one of them". You can get ICS 310-1 (NFES 1414) from NIFC-PMS that has all the ICS jobs and requirements. Mollysboy
04/24	Is anyone besides me concerned about the new 2002 Standards for Operations? It's new guidance that hasn't been seen by most fire management staffs, but is our new "Standards". This page is part of the 30 mile action items and recent letter. (No link was added in the letter but I found this page addressing it.) Here it is... www.fire.blm.gov/Standards/redbook.htm. Note the USFS concurrence in the pages and reference. As of today, I'd hate to be a type 3, 4 or 5 IC and have to follow all of the guidance that USED to be relayed down to the Crew Bosses and Firefighters. As it is written now, the ICs are fully responsible. Its probably the last time I take an IC job. As it is written, an IC MUST personally mitigate all of the 10 and 18 AND ALL SAFETY HAZARDS.... I have lots of questions about this memo but... personally... how do I personally mitigate "the weather is getting hotter and drier" ?... should I make a prayer to God since he caused the weather to get hotter and drier... How should I document my prayer to god as required by the document? Just my questions as well as a few ADFMOs, DFMOs, FAFMOs, and FFMOs. NorCal Tom
04/24	Hi Ab Here are some photos. Column from the Buck Mountain Fire on the Blue Ridge Parkway, NPS, in Roanoke VA. The forest fire burned into a tire dump of 4 to 5 million tires. Total size was 1046 acres. (Fire 10) Here's a photo of Allen L. of the Blue Ridge Parkway during a burnout operation (Handcrew 5) and a photo of our NPS engine lineup (Engines 4). Scotty
04/24	Hi Ab, Josh From Fort Hunter Liggett Here, Here are some pictures for the Engine Page. #1 Type 3 4x4 W/CAFS #2 & #3 1250 Gal. 6x6 Combination Water Tender/ Brush Engine. Both serve the U.S. Army Fort Hunter Liggett F.D. in Southren Monterey County CA. Put em on the Engines 4 page. Ab.
04/24	Ab, here's the Forest ranger LOGO. anyeco Check Logo5. Ab.
04/24	meredith, glad to hear from you, Check out Galls catalog. or Galls.com they have something like you're looking for. Its a belt holster for holding EMS shears, notepad, pens, papers (maps), has a radio holster, small cell phone/pager pocket, and some other little doodads. I put the shears in our med kit, and stuffed my leatherman into the pouch the shears go, it fits perfect. later and see you this summer. eric
04/24	hey Ab, I want to share these two pics of the Oversite Fire, March 1, 2002 to March 12, 2002 in the huachuca mountains. sierra vista az Serge Thanks, I put them on Fire 10. Ab.
04/24	Say Ab, Here's a fresh pic of my motley looking crew from Bullard VFD (Handcrew 5), and yes I'm the oddball one in in the group, I told them I would wear my day suit but I was also wearing my SAR colors as well. So I'm the on one on the end with the red cap on. I will cautiously say that I watched Superfire cause I was home babysittin and weren't nothing better to do, but I'm glad MOTOS wasn't here or she would have nitpicked it to death she hasn't stayed married to me or 18 years without learning what we do. Just say I won't watch it again.:o) Saty safe all. Keith
04/24	Ab, I'm trying to find the requirements for the different ICS positions. I've been redcarded for different jobs for years now, but the 45 lb. is gettin' a bit tough. I'm specifically interested in IOFC2 or SOF2 since I'm carded in both, and hear they require the moderate level. Can you help with a link or site that lists the requirements? Thanks in advance RW (NC Forest Service since '88)
04/24	Here is a link for news on the 'Snaking" fire SW of Denver. Last I heard it was 1400 acres, no containment, high winds, and a town of 4400 people (Bailey, CO) being evacuated. http://www.thedenverchannel.com/den/news/stories/news-141552120020424-070441.html Take care & Adios, CJD
04/24	I intend to use the original intent ten standard firefighting orders written by the shoshone national forest forester for a standards class I'm teaching. However, I find it very disappointing that after all these years people like this forester continue to use phrases like "maintain control of your men at all times" and "maintain prompt communication with your men" The orders he wrote are very good, but other than that I don't think very much of this man. We are in the year 2002 and this is the progress we have made? ME Here are the Original Intent 10 Standard Firefighting Orders again. ME, do you object to the "men" or to the "maintain control" or both? Ab.
04/24	I was recently on your website previewing some photographs. I work for SRA/McGraw-Hill a Children's Textbook. I am currently doing some photo research looking for some firefighter photographs as follows. factory-type building on fire, and after fire, standing but damaged. fire helicopter, if people are visible must include women and all people in uniforms arm and basket of a fire snorkel group of firefighters with a life net firefighter wearing hazmat equipment, prefer African-American or Hispanic person Firefighters Acetylene torch Firefighters chain saw fire/rescue squad diving suit firefighters doing routine housework at firehouse firefighters washing firehoses as diverse as possible 911 operator with headset fire inspector at work fire snorkel on the way to a fire. the firefighters should be visable. Would you have any of these photographs? I would be interested in seeing some digital previews if possible. Thank you for your time. I look forward to hearing from you. Lori Shetler Ph: 614-430-6655 lori_shetler@mcgraw-hill.com Readers, I told Lori we may have some photos in the helo and ff and chainsaw categories but probably only at 72 dpi. Maybe some of you have some of these other categories -- especially some of you more urban interface type firefighters. Do you urban ff even use a life net any more? Why would that surprise me? Ummm, I may have a washing the firehose photo.... Ab.
04/24	I found this info on one of local TV stations web site. Thought you would like to know more about this fire. I think reporters said yesterday that the fire was burning at 10,000 feet on the side of that mountain. Right now there is no snow on the ground at that height, but normally we would still have it. Looks like the beginning of a rough, long season. Snaking fire burns 1,000 acres, threatens homes, closes schools CAFSman Good map and photos. Ab.
04/24	Good Pre-Summer to you all out there in the wild frontiers. I understand the “Dragon” Has gotten a head start this year. Don’t sweat it too much, I trust all of you to be fully capable of doing your best. That is all I, or anyone relegated off the line could ever ask from any of you. Make us proud. The topic of my once in a blue moon fusee tossed your way this day is a book I found in my campus book store under the philosophy category. (This Category is located next to the Cliff’s notes if you mistakenly thought your “Pup” to be wiser than his years…) It is titled The Seasons of Fire and is authored by David J. Strohmaier, a 15 year veteran of the firelines. This book is published by the University of Nevada Press. Mr. Strohmaier has very interesting ideas on why we as the guardians of the wilderness continue to punish ourselves year after year. This is a good read for both the firefighter and the family member. Maybe you can actually justify that new set of Nicks, Whites or Wescos to your significant other after letting them read a few chapters, who knows. Good luck, and stay safe, hope I won’t have the need to meet many of you this summer, but it will be an honor to work alongside you all. Here’s to a safe season. Tiny, the R-6 Urban Interface / College Fire Dog Hi Tiny, and thanks. Someone else just sent in a thumbs-up review of that book for the reviews page. I'll get both of these up soon. If people want to order it or any other book or thing sold by Amazon, please enter through our Amazon portal and help pay the bills. Thanks All. Ab.
04/24	Burnin' in CO! Other fires in AZ... Be ready to go! Wildfire chars 800 acres in Colorado AD Check our Fire News Page. Lots of fires burning. Ab.
04/24	Kirk, I would like to say hang in there. Right now I am going through cancer treatment with my mother who was recently diagnosed with throat cancer (squamous cell or BDS). She has never smoked or drunk in her 55 years of life and it is amazing that she has this type of cancer . Hang in there Kirk and have a positive attitude. My prayers are with you and your family. An-R5er
04/24	Snaking Fire In Colorado is now over 800 hundred acres!!! RW BE SAFE. Ab.
04/24	* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Today is birthday day for Krstofer. Please gang up on Krs and send him an email birthday message: alpine13@yahoo.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
04/23	The Snaking Fire in Colorado is ripping. 200 acres, growing fast, lots of evacuations and homes threatened. cofire
04/23	Still Trying, Sounds like you have the right career path lined up for yourself if you are shooting for a jumper job. 1-2 years on a Hotshot crew will benefit your resume immensely when reviewed by the jumpers. Be aware that BLM jumpers follow higher physical fitness standards for their program over and above the National standards. 9:30 or better mile and a half, 12 pull ups, etc. Best thing you can do is alot of running and hiking under heavy weight (90lbs) during the winter in case you get an offer. Also talk to the base or ops managers. AK is probably out of the question to actually visit but if you are in Boise, stop by and introduce yourself then follow up with phone calls. Boise jumpers can be reached at 208-387-5426 and AK at 907-356-5540. Dunno about actual training classes to make your resume look better except maybe ICT4 and ICT3. Anyone? Old R5er
04/23	Wow - been working with the VFD here in the Foothills of Colorado for 20 years and I can't ever remember a Red Flag warning this early in the season. Got a little rain/snow over the weekend, but two days of dry wind took it all away. Put us into a Red Flag warning today! The Governor has declared a drought emergency in the state as well. Heads up and stay safe out there. Still wishing for that 4 foot spring snow! Take care & Adios, CJD
04/23	Most likely you may have seen this by now, but just in case. How it the time to be thin'n about what's happening and getting ready for what will happen. www.cdc.gov/niosh/hid14.html Hickman
04/23	For the person who asked about the movie "Superfire" and wanted opinions, start here: www.airtanker.com/wwwboard/messages/7026.html and read the rest of the responses from the airtanker pilots. k <haw><haw> the truth will out! Old Fire Guy, I do want to borrow your copy. My local video store doesn't have this one. Ab.
04/23	From Firescribe: Fires in Arizona www.arizonarepublic.com/arizona/articles/0423fire23.html
04/23	Jobs page, Wildland Firefighter Job Series 0462 and 0455 Pages are updated. Engine Boss wanted based out of Wenatchee WA, and lots of fire ecology positions for those who are academically inclined. Remember if you have had jobs or the series pages book-marked, hit our new links here and update your bookmarks. Ab.
04/23	***In response to Eric PW on 4/17, Thanks for the wishes...I am very excited about working for this district (ok, so it is closer to home and my husband, than my last 2 districts) I'm sure it will be a very busy season (as usual) and I look forward to the work. This district seems to have all their ducks in a row & are big on training, can't beat that! When you are this way, get in touch...we'll be having BBQ's with the fire folks as much as the dragon will allow us. ***Also, does anyone know where to get a organizer that attaches to your belt and holds, multi-purpose tool, pen/pencil, small notebook, small flashlight, etc? I have looked all over town, Wal*Marts, Kmart's, and various other sporting/camping stores and can not locate one. Any help would be greatly appreciated. They are so convenient & are easier to access than digging in your pockets. ***Despite all the recent moisture this winter, I am sure that this years fire season will still be a great one, Just wanted to wish everyone a safe & exciting summer. Please be safe and remember, NEVER compromise our 10 & 18! I'm sure this will open up a can of worms, and I understand that the movie industry does not know real fire fighting tactics, but my husband and I both watched the show "Super Fire" and wondered how many "bloopers" were so obvious to everyone else? Just a thought though...when they dropped the "bomb" it was designed to "take the O2 out, resulting in putting the fire out." But what about the smoke jumpers & kids that were stuck in the middle of that fire? Wouldn't they of been deprived of O2 as well? And since when did a hotshot crew "carry" such a device since it had to be dropped by an aircraft? I wonder if we'll get one to carry with us on our engine? Just a thought. Great Basin Firefighter (the original) --noticed there was another. lol Lotsa classifieds ads coming out next Wednesday. Bet you'll be able to find something there. Ab.
04/23	hey gang- does anyone out there know of anything i can do to better myself in the competition for a position in smokejumping? i know i can't be picky but if i could chose, i would like to work for the BLM doing it. i have one season on a type 2 crew and i am going to be on a shot crew this summer. what about training? there is a fire academy near my house that teaches wildfire. any recommendations on courses to take in the winter? i am aware that busting your ass on the line on a shot crew greatly increases your chance of a good recommendation from the supt., but so does working smarter, not harder correct? thank you in advance as any help or advice will be much appreciated :) Still Trying
04/23	You can read all about the Osborne Firefinderfire and detection in the "Firefighter's Guide" NFES 1571 available from the NIFC fire cache. I'm surprised so many are unaware of this valuable guide which has basic nuts and bolts information about fire detection, prevention, pre-suppression (preparedness), and suppression. The distance and line-of-sight tape on the firefinder is scaled in inches and as most firefinder maps are 1/2 inch to the mile, once a fire is pinpointed correctly, the crow-fly distance to it from the lookout is simple to figure out. Tom
04/23	For anyone who wanted to make the Winema Hotshot Reunion (and Star Crew and Rogue and Prospect), if you couldn't make it, we have the first round of photos up: http://wildfirenews.com/winema/gallery/reunion ~ kbob
04/22	Everyone, First of all THANKS SO MUCH to those in the fire community who have donated leave to Kirk Smith, the Mormon Lake Hotshot Superintendent. All of it is very much needed and appreciated. All of those individual contributions add up to being really helpful for someone who deserves our support. For those of you that may not have the privilege to know him, Kirk has been on the Mormon Lake Hotshot Crew on the Coconino National Forest in R3 in one capacity or another for nearly 19 years. He was diagnosed with sinus cancer in April, 2001 and went through radiation and chemotherapy throughout the spring and summer which meant lots of time off work. By November, the cancer appeared to be in remission and Kirk returned to his job. In March of this year, the cancer returned and had spread to his spine, bone, blood, and liver. The gift of science has come a long way in the treatment of cancer and now Kirk faces intensive chemotherapy, along with a future blood infusion and bone marrow transplant. Because of the expected ten+ month duration of this treatment, he is really in need of leave. None of us can help to this extent, but everyone can help a little bit and every little bit helps! Kirk has given so much not only to the Hotshot community, but to the wildland fire community as a whole. He is a great employee and a great friend to many. I can promise you that the donated leave and support that is being given makes all the difference in the world. Right now his medical expenses are pretty well covered, and it's the leave and support that are needed the most. Kirk has a wife and three children. AB ...... thanks so much for sharing this information. I know you have the leave donor case number info that you have been forwarding on to those who ask. For those who want to access this information directly on the FS Intranet, here's the link for all leave donors in the FS. Kirk will be found under R3. http://fsweb.wo.fs.fed.us/hrm/ If you work for the Department of Interior, the form to use for leave donation is the OF-630 A/B form. If anyone would like to send a card or note, they can send them to me and I'll make sure that Kirk gets them. Thanks again so very much for the support. Cathie Zettler District Fire Management Officer Mormon Lake Ranger District / Coconino National Forest 4373 S. Lake Mary Road Flagstaff, Arizona 86001 czettler@fs.fed.us Kirk, my prayers are for your good recovery. Cathie, please keep us up-to-date. Ab.
04/22	Thanks, Firescribe, for the Sadler Report link. Ab.
04/22	A couple of News Notes from the Abs at wildlandfire.com: We have moved the links page, jobs page and jobs series 0462 and 0455 to our new server along with the large training power point files which we moved last month. Last night we changed all the internal links and border buttons to reflect those changes. If you have any of those pages book-marked, please go to the new location via the border buttons and update your bookmarks. Those pages will remain on our original server until Friday so your bookmarks will access them directly until then. After that, if you use your old bookmark, you will get a page that has a forwarding message and you'll be sent to the new location. The Classifieds Page is going to make its DEBUT next Wednesday, May 1, 2002. There has been a fine response from the fire business community who think it will benefit them to have links to their businesses on the Classifieds Page. There are also some fine folks who will be supporting some of the pages with banners that link to their businesses. We appreciate the support of all involved. So far we have invited and involved people and businesses who have come recommended by you or have been posters/lurkers here for some time. If any of you have any other favorites and haven't let us know - in chat or in an e-mail - who might like to profit from this new opportunity, please let us know now (abercrombie@wildlandfire.com).Nothing like having these great resources right here on wildlandfire.com when questions about gear and boots and sanitation, etc comes up. Nothing like browsing and purchasing from the businesses of those who are part of our wildland fire community and want to support us. We also appreciate those of you who are supporting this site simply because you want to. If any of you want to put in a free firefighter-to-firefighter ad, please let us know that also. We all have gear and stuff in our closets, garages, and yards that could get recycled. For word limits and format, click on the classifieds button in the top border and go to the FF free link. We Abs want to THANK  OUR  WILDLAND  FIRE  COMMUNITY again for existing, for being so open with your information, questions, opinions, personalities, venting, humor and photos. As all who read and participate here know, we are truly enriched by each other. OK, final Ab question: Anyone know where the Sadler Fire Entrapment Investigation report is online besides on our links page? Now that the DOI sites are back up, we'd like to put the link to their copy and take it off our server which has been full to overflowing for some time and has also exceeded bandwidth on more than one occasion as the site has grown. Ab.
04/22	If any of you need Donor Leave Case Number info to donate leave time to our hotshot supt who could use it, let Ab know. We have it and will forward it on.
04/22	RE Osborne fire finder The other sight was for a vertical reading. Dispatchers had a set of panoramic 360 degree photographs from each lookout calibrated to the horizontal and vertical angles. With both readings a dispatcher could look at the photos and see exactly where the fire was, fuel type, etc. Many offices still have some sets of these old photos stuffed in drawers somewhere. I have seen a few on display in visitor centers. Gordon So you think maybe they would know the distances from factoring the fire location on the photo into the mix? Ab.
04/21	MOC4546 From what I understand a Federal employee can not "volunteer" (as in unpaid) for anything within the agency while employed (you can volunteer while on furlough if a WAE or temp seasonal employee). If you are providing a service for the agency you must be compensated. I have been prevented from attending training and interagency drills I was willing to "volunteer" for. Most other employers have similar rules and I believe it is a Federal law because I recall reading about career firefighters in the Eastern US being barred from also being volunteer firefighters with the employing department, this was a court ruling not a departmental thing. The reasoning for this is to avoid situations exactly like you describe (Mandatory volunteering) and is part of the reason for things like Comptime and credit hours, however if you are an exempt employee I don't know if any of this applies to you, OPM would be another good place to start looking for information. Fedfire
04/21	hey All, Did anyone check out the primetimer "SuperFire" on ABC?? I suppose the C-47 must have stayed at a Holiday Inn Express, 'cause C-47 (DC 3) aren't tankers, they just play one on TV.... :o) Anyhow, the guys at the station seemed to like the show (since they don't have much wildland fire knowledge), I could have been doing something else, like running EMS calls. Does anyone know where the show was filmed. The local fire department depicted in the movie looked as if the engine and ambulance might have been Aussie or Canadian. R-3 has sparked up again with a 2000 acre fire (Merick) on the Coronado down towards Sierra Vista AZ. Get your gear ready, the southwest is primed! AZ Trailblazer
04/21	So did anyone actually watch Superfire? I just read the blurb on it from ABC's website, and at this point I think I'm glad I was out sampling (in moderation, of course) some of my areas finer micros... Thanks for the link, Ab, I appreciated the chuckle. -FireBill Well this Ab was ready for sampling the flick (good or bad), beer in hand, kicked back... there was a local fundraising telathon on instead. Yeesh. Had to go rent a movie. Heard I missed the action in firechat too. Hey SCC and lptd, if you're on tonight, I'll be sure and stop by. I heard there are lots of fires in SoCal as well as elsewhere in the West.
04/21	First time poster looking for Lars L out of R-9 Superior National Forest, just wanted to say hi and see how ya'll are doing. I hope that this works.... bustin as@ in colorado Someone off on fire, the lucky dog. Ab.
04/21	Ab, Here's a question about the Osborne Fire Finder. The front sight has two sets of crosshairs and then the rear sight has that "slide" which is used to obtain horizontal degree readings. I've figured that there must be a way to determine distance but have never been able to find anything in any literature. A couple weeks ago, I asked an old tower guy who recalled having read that you could "get a second cross by yourself" by using that slide piece. If anyone has the "formula" or any info about that it would be much appreciated. Stay Safe! "Kicks"
04/20	WP! Oh-my-gawd-- Have I been operating under a misperception!!! I always thought WP stood for Whine-y Person. I am sooooooo sorry to have misjudged you these last two-and-a-half years! <small smerk><raised eyebrow><cocked head><laughing> Mellie
04/20	There has been a question posed regarding Primary and Secondary Firefighters performing an act of "free labor contrition" before being allowed to go off-park/forest/district in the Federal Wildland Fire System. Where I am working Secondary Firefighters have been told by e-mail and paper memo that "Before they are allowed to go out on assignment for the season they must have the Refresher Course, the Pack Test, and must perform "a 1-2 Day outside course to demonstrate skills for off-park assignment on "X" Dates". There is no overtime authorized, scheduled vacations are not an excuse, simply not being able to attend or if there is no work relief to go to the class because the secondary firefighter's supervisors know that FMO use this tactic to get free labor out of those outside FMO for a project that they either don't have the people to do or don't want to pay for it. Furthermore, if the date set by FMO cannot be met people will be held back from going on assignments. This is even being applied to Primary firefighters saying you won't be allowed to go off on assignment if you don't perform the free work. Is this legal anywhere in USFS, BLM, NPS, BIA, or USFWS? I've heard it go both ways but I would like to here what some of the other forests, districts, parks, reservations, and refuges require of both types of firefighters, and what they legally can do to stop someone from going because that individual did not perform a free act of labor. MOC4546
04/20	superfire airs on abc   (Ab note: Tonight at 7PM Central time and 9PM Pacific.) check it out should be good for a laugh or who knows? http://abc.abcnews.go.com/primetime/movies/superfire.html TT
04/20	To whom it may concern, My name is Andy <snip>, and I am 17 years old. I live in the suburbs of Denver and am a Junior in High School. I am very interested wildfire fighting, and was wondering if you could please send me any information on any programs you might have for someone of my age. I am not sure of the age requirement for wildfire training, but if there is any opportunities for a person of my age, I would greatly appreciate any information. Thank you very much for taking the time to read this letter. sincerely, Andy Hey, CAFSman and other Colorado Firefighters, is there a ROP (Regional Occupational Program) in CO or any other kind of participation in wildland fire for teens? Have to be 18 to fight fire for the feds. Ab.
04/20	Ab, the post by Snake River Sparky is excellent! Could you put that on the FAQ page so it could be easily found, I get lots of calls from people who want to get into the "business" and it would be a good place to refer them to. Also, quite a few posts (with passion) concerning Hot Shot Tee Shirts, I don't know what the fuss is all about, I got mine at the HS gift shop -- only cost $10. When I wear it nobody EVER would confuse me with a REAL HS, I don't whine nearly long and loud enough. WP Good idea, we get those also. I put it on the FAQ page. Ab.
04/20	I myself was on a crew and I know what being a hotshot is all about. I'm not stupid, only trying to help out a friend. For those of you who do not think that I have earned the collection, you have another thing coming. As My 2 Cents has mentioned, I would have not got the collection started had it not been for specific reasons. I have many letters from crews and superintendents quoting "after all you are a part of our crew". I know the value of the possession and know of no other collection in the nation. Looks like the consensus is to see that the public never gets a hold of them. I will do my best to see that they always have a good home, even if I keep them forever. I will continue to work with the crews and continue to finish the collection, not many left to get. I will not mention the person's name either, only that he is in need and is one of our own. If we say we are robust bunch, then let's be that bunch. Whether it be "Leave Time or Money", we can help. P.S. If any of you have a better idea for the collection or a good home, please let me know. rowdy Thanks for your comments, My 2 Cents, Old Fire Guy, Houston, ab, Firebum and SLN (and whoever else has written in since I sent this to Ab).
04/20	Ab, To AJM regarding R-4 contract. Here is a quick primer on R-4 fire contracting and my view from the cheap seats. NIFC is messing around with a national "call-when-needed" engine contract based on geographical locations and "best value" pricing to the government. This means, basically, they take into account experience of crew, equipment and engine age and capabilities and throw them all into a blender and come up with what they call "best value." I know NIFC is trying to get it out this year, but it is behind schedule as it is being churned in the political grinder. As this document has been explained to me, it is basically a location-based "super EERA" with no guarantee of income. Most regions have what are called EERAs (emergency equipment rental agreements). Although some call these contracts, they are really agreements that mean if the government needs what you have, the price has already been agreed to by both parties and the contractor agrees to follow government rules of operation such as equipment, min. insurance and workman's comp., etc. There is no promise they will ever use you, only how much they will pay you if they do. But for many, this is the starting point of their businesses. Great Basin EERAs are managed out of the R-4 Forest Service office in Ogden, Utah. Contact the contracting officer responsible for engine and tender EERAs. In the past, contractors with EERAs were mostly dispatched out of the regional dispatch centers. R-4--as are other regions--is moving the responsibility for dispatching contract fire equipment down to the district and forest level. The region is doing this because, in the past, when the NIFC sit report said there was a 50 acre fire in Elko or wherever, a pack of out-of-region engine contractors descend on the place, banging on the door looking for an equipment order number (E-number)--which is the holy grail of getting paid. So basically, the gov is trying to get rid of the smoke chasers and fire Gypsies. In the world of EERAs, good operators get asked to the Ball by dispatch, sleeziods just roam around from fire to fire hoping to get a date. One quickly learns that the wildland fire community is a very small world with a grapevine that travels at the speed of light. In the fire contracting business, your good name is your most valuable asset. So play by Uncle Sam's rules. Since there is a push in R-4 for engine contractors to be dispatched by their local agencies, it would behoove anyone getting into "the business" to get to know the Fire Management Officer, the Fire Control Officer and the Lead Dispatcher in the forest or BLM district These people need to know who you are, your level of experience, personnel and equipment. If you have a good operation and equipment and well-trained people who know what they are doing, and the local agency is somewhat open to using non-agency resources to pull up the slack on a fire or two, then you might get lucky and get a call if the season heats up. You might get ever luckier if the year turns out to be a big burn, which are far and few between.            But then again, you might live in an area where "no way in hell" will you ever get a call unless the last dog is hung or River City is about to be overrun by fire and they don't have anything else to throw at it. In this situation, either you're a lousy operator with a bad reputation--sort of like the Clampets showing up with a flatbed farm truck with a septic tank and trash pump on the back and helping themselves to agency equipment whenever no one's looking--or, the fire gods may have an attitude towards non-agency fire people in general. If either of these is the case, find another line of work. You're screwed. Although they're about as rare as 1943-S pennies, some forests let "exclusive use" engine contracts. In these situations, contractors are paid to place personnel or equipment in a specific location for a specified period of time. There is a highly competitive bidding process for these. Now, a reality check. There is no shortage of contractors with Type 6 engines looking for work. Since they are easy to build and relatively cheap to operate, and can be used in the off-season to haul concrete forms, hay or whatever, they are quite common. I was on a fire in R-5 (California) several years ago and saw a 1/2 mile long line of private Type Six engines.            Approach fire contracting with your eyes open, realizing that the engine itself is just a fraction of the total cost of keeping it and its crew on the road with specialized equipment, vehicle insurance, general liability, fuel and maintenance and workman's comp. Since Region 4 is not known for its thousands of rippling lakes and other handy water sources, fire managers in the Great Basin like rigs that carry a lot of water, such as Type 4s and 5s. But the bigger the water payload, the more expensive the rig. Then there is the issue of Red Cards, the universal proof of fire training and qualifications. If you or your people don't have them and are not qualified at the level you are trying to work at, then you are going to get shown the door (and rightfully should). Also, even though you may be able to take wildland classes from a local forest or BLM district, they generally will not issue Red Cards. Consider joining one of the contractor associations such as the National Wildfire Suppression Association (NWSA). They have a good Red Card program. Finally, good fire contractors are a vital resource to the Government. Making a fire contracting business work takes a lot of planning, training and effort. Not to mention a good business sense, a source of capital and people skills. Many failed fire contract businesses learned through hard experience that putting a pump, tank and hose reel on a truck was one of the easiest parts of starting the business. Bon Appetite! Snake River Sparky Nicely done, Sparky! Thanks for the info. Ab.
04/20	hey there nevada terratorch, hey it is jackson rookie here, hey thanks for writing back. if you could like to stay in future contact you can write me at my email address @ tut_981@hotmail.com. feel free to drop me a line. i just worked with a guy from elko nevada that detailed on there with us just this past month or so. his name was steven <snip> i think it was.  well every one again have a safe and wonderful fire season and hope to meet some of ya guys out there on the line... sincerely, jackson rookie
04/20	To everyone who seems to have a comment whether they were a Hotshot or not and what their t-shirt means to them. Take heed. Its time to stop making the statements like "I'd rather put up money than buy a Hotshot shirt!!!" PUT UP OR SHUT UP!!! A brother is in need... I may not have been around for as long as many, but I did serve almost 9 years on a Hotshot crew and I am sickened by the Bullsh*t that is going on here as well as in the chat page. Thats not what I learned from being a California Hotshot!!!! If you are a Hotshot or former Hotshot, put up or shut up. Donate A/L or give money, or offer to buy the shirts.... dont just talk shit.... A TRUE HOTSHOT ALWAYS SUPPORTS A BROTHER.. Enough of this BS... Whoever buys the shirts could donate them to a museum and make all the parties happy.... SoCalCapt Didn't make chat last night. Was some kickin' needed? Ab.
04/19	Here's some interesting stuff from the National Weather Service (posted April 1st): LOCATION * RAIN **NORMAL PERCENT OF NORMAL --------------------------------------------------------- LOS ANGELES DOWNTOWN 4.27...13.94......31% LOS ANGELES AP 3.98...12.20......33% LAKE CACHUMA 11.18...24.93......45% MOUNT WILSON 11.91...36.80......32% OXNARD WFO 6.19...14.95......41% PALMDALE 2.16... 6.81......32% PASO ROBLES 7.88...13.42......59% SAN LUIS OBISPO (POLY) 14.12...22.49......62% SANTA BARBARA CITY 8.65...17.37......50% SANTA MARIA AP 6.17...12.79......48% It gets worse the further south or inland you go. Any one got any info on the I-5 fires down near Stockton CA? Just caught a mention of them on the CHP CAD page and one note said "Big".... Is that 5 acres big or 5000 acres BIG? SoCalCapt
04/19	My Two Cents & SLN, I think you guys are getting a little carried away with the "Be One, Love One, or Kill One" and "NO MATTER WHAT" cliches. They are just shirt, I know what these shirts mean to Shots and how they feel about having them out in the publics hand, but again they are just shirts. Here's something to think about, if you see somebody out wearing a IHC shirt and ask him about it - chances are he is from that crew or has been on that crew and has earned the right to wear it. If the person wearing the shirt is not from that crew or hasn't been on that crew then it's just a shirt, a shirt that represents that IHC. A IHC shirt doesnt mean anything without a person or crew to go with it, without an IHC member wearing it, its just a shirt - a good shirt - even a great shirt that represents something great - but just a shirt. Rowdy is wanting to do something great, with a great thing, for some great people...let him. Myself, I would rather see my crew shirt "out and about" on someones back that is appreciative of the IHC rather than stuck on some wall in a museum. Get back with me.........I got more....... NativeFlamez
04/19	What alot of words flying about clothes. I spent a decade on a shot crew and I hate to think how much money I've spent hats, coats, sweatshirts, long and short sleeve shirts, buckles and who knows what other crew stuff. I don't believe the clothes should be out there for the general public, "BUT" the agency doesn't by the stuff for you and the minute any of them try to tell me what I can do with something that doesn't belong to them they can kiss my fat (__.__). I understand the heartburn people having, especially shots that have earned their colors, but I have known a good number of them that don't belong in them. Take a chill pill it's for a good cause and hope that person will do the right thing with the collection. A butt-chewing isn't what they needed but I don't know "maybe" some ideas would of helped. I'll tell you what I would have done if someone would of jumped my butt like some of you people did. I would of went out and gave them to every bum and dirtbag I could find. Maybe even donated to the county jail. "but" if I did that some old hotshots might end up with them. Take care and be safe, sorry for being so long winded. Sign me, "Hotshots shirts for sale"
04/19	As "My 2 Cents" suggests, donate some leave to the IHC Supt. Let's help take care of one of our own. I won't mention the person's name here to protect privacy, but Ab can tell you who it is. Thanks. Houston Ab feels privileged to play the middle man on this one. Let's support our own with leave time.
04/19	Hotshot shirts As a member of several hotshot crews over the years, I can tell you that selling those shirts to the public is not right. As someone else already stated, there are only a couple of ways to earn those shirts -- be one or love one. Those shirts are not supposed to be passed around or sold to anyone. I don't think there is one IHC crew out there that differs. Alot of pride and hard work is put into those shirts and they should not be for sale to anyone that has not experienced what being part of a hotshot crew is all about. We have even had individuals that quit mid season and all shirts, hats, and patches were bought back because they couldn't make it. Keep the shirts with the people that have worked hard and earned them, thats who they are for. Firebum
04/19	Get Off Your Highhorse: You obviously ain't got a freaking clue what you're talking about . Rowdy would have never gotten hold of the IHC shirts from any of the crews if it was not for a specific purpose, such as was previously mentioned. Crews historically have not given out their shirts to anyone, except for special reasons. There are 3 other ways to get a crew shirt from a Hotshot Crew. Be One, Love One or Kill One. The IHC Supt. with cancer is a friend of mine and I have already donated leave, and will do so again as long as he needs it. If you are a Federal Employee I would suggest you do the same for someone you care about. So why don't you apply for an Interagency Hotshot Crew and if you are fortunate enough to get hired, you will see why the shirts are "treasured" by the people who wear them. My 2 Cents
04/19	OK PYRO, There are several companies that make the helo-torch they may also make the terra-torch. Check at terratorch.com. Keep in mind they have to be DOT approved now days. Completely enclosed so the human body is not exposed to the surfire and gas. This goes for all models as I was told, some can be retrofitted for about 12 K. Not sure if it's a Region 5 thing or national. One company is Fire Specs. in Carmel Ca. another company is Western Helo. torch based in Canada, which has a sister Co. somewhere in US. and as we speak Boise is testing some units to see if they can be approved. the meat
04/19	Hey ab, I was wondering if anyone knew of any Group or Individual Health Insurance plans that specialize in either Temporary Gov't employees or Wildland Firefighters. Just checking to see if there are any other options out there for me. Thanks, paddlefire
04/19	Jobs page, Wildland Firefighter Job Series 0462 and 0455 Pages are updated. Ab.
04/19	Here's a link to those Colorado fires. It snowed overnight, which helped. Don't miss the slide show. www.thedenverchannel.com/den/news/stories/ Firescribe Thanks Firescribe. We also appreciate the heads up from those who are local to the fires (thanks cs) or have knowledge (thanks r6). Ab.
04/19	To "my 2 cents" whoever that is: Well, aren't you special. You think somebody ought to not be able to do what they want with IHC shirts? How do you figure this person was "were presented the shirts from the crews " anyway? You don't know that. We're not talking historical artifacts here, just tee-shirts, okay? If you want to "donate a higher market price" you better find out what the market price is first. (and then what are you going to do with your treasure anyway? Donate it to a museum? Which one? Get off your high horse.
04/19	hey all, crapy weather here in north central nevada. bring on the heat ! hey ECS, talked to harry in the tower yesterday. c-11 was on a fire and harry told him i was on the way. too funny. you be careful this summer. i know things are pretty ugly out there. ya can always give me a call as a single resource ! hey eric pw, maybe we can get together this time. let me know when you will be in town. we will be hiring for crew supervisors soon. here is the linc. look under agriculture and conservation http://www.state.nv.us/personnel/joblist.html BCDavis
04/19	Michael, I know people who have had both Wesco and White boots and have preferred the Whites. I have used Whites for over 20 years, and the only other boot that I would consider is Nicks. One suggestion that I would make for any boot is to get the rough-outs. They are much more comfortable. 6
04/19	Michael: Please do yourself a big favor…buy a pair of White’s “Original Smoke Jumper” boots with a 10” top. Though it is true that there are many quality boot options to choose from such as, Buffalo, Nick’s, Wesco, and Danner to name a few, don’t take a chance on something as important to a wildland firefighter as your feet. I have been a wildland firefighter for 29 years (16 years on a Hotshot Crew) and during that time have been closely associated with hundreds of friends and co-workers who also work in the wildland firefighting arena, so I have a pretty good base to develop footwear recommendations from Over time, of these folks (firefighters) I’m acquainted with have settled on one brand or another of boots that may suit their own personal needs well, and will whole heartedly recommend/argue for the brand of their choice to/with all, hoping that it will satisfy the needs of the person or person’s they are advising, and in many cases the advice is sound and well meaning, but, I warn you to take the advice with a “grain of salt.” Boots are a very personal item and folks tend to demonstrate strong devotion to the boot they wear whether they fit well or not, just because it’s their boot. Advocates of a certain boot brand will argue their point vehemently with anyone who questions their choice, primarily because they are afraid of being stigmatized as having made a poor choice, and will wear that boot brand for their whole career just to prove that they have the best boot brand even if their feet are hurting like hell. Some good analogies of this phenomenon, would be how people argue their point concerning crummy dogs, horses, firearms, beer, girl and boy friends, and wives and husbands. It’s just human nature to want our choice to be the best even if it’s wrong. Now back to the point of this long ramble (sorry), that is, why I think you (or any body) should go with the White’s brand. The majority of wildland firefighters, who do a lot of walking/working such as hotshots, smoke jumpers, engine crews, and even helicopter personnel (though they don’t walk/work very often…just kidding) have settled on White’s. All these folks went with this brand for a reason, they just plane, hands down, bottom line, fit the majority of people the best. The odds are, for your first pair of boots, White’s would most likely fit you well. After you are a little more seasoned, and have gained a knowledge base concerning what would be the best for you, shop around and maybe one of the other brands will fit you better (doubtful, but you never know). Some other suggestions I would pass on to you are…take a look at the elk-tan rough-out (lighter than the black-kip and wont crack as much over time), stay away from the lace-to-toe (sticks, mud, and slurry will get caught in the laces. Will provide a rough point that could hang-up and trip you). Honey Vibrams are softer to walk on and wont leave black marks on the floor (but do wear out faster). The black-kip are more water resistant than the elk-tan, but only 5 minutes more, so I don’t feel they are worth the extra weight. Good luck on your eventual choice and I hope this information helps you, I also recommend you ask around, I think most folks will agree with my thoughts, but a few won’t (and I bet we’ll hear from them!). Once or twice around the block
04/18	Ab Another fire going on in CO in addition to Topaz, its near Ft Collins and last estimate was 600 acres. cs
04/18	Good Afternoon Abercrombie, Wesco is currently looking into interesting or amazing firsthand wildland firefighter accounts that involve our boots (eg. how they may have gotten in a situation but their boots never failed them). I was wondering if you could do a posting on your site in the "they said" section and see if anyone is interested in telling us their story and possibly having their name and picture appear in a magazine (15 mins of fame!). You can have these people contact me at ben@westcoastshoe.com. Let me know if you have any questions and if this is doable. Thanks, Ab. Talk to you soon. Regards, Ben Here it is, Ben. Wearers of Wesco, want to exercise your storytelling skills? Ab.
04/18	Dear Ab, I was wondering if you or anyone else knows of a website for terra torch design plans or fabricating. I have found several pictures of terra torches but none that show an up-close view of the pump and nozzle. Thanks for your time. OKpyro.
04/18	colorado has a fire going on topaz mountain sounds like a ripper going 250 acres in a hour r6
04/18	I'm looking for a cap with the El Cariso logo ("Ruptured Duck"). Anyone out there know if the crew has its logo back? Rowdy: It would be great if some ff was willing to buy the collection from you intact. They could display, and you could make a contribution to a friend in need. But.....firefighters are a robust bunch, most not particularly concerned about the trappings. What we are is not in a shirt, and not requiring enshrinement. Sell the shirts if you want, and do a good deed for someone else. It's cool. Old Fire Guy
04/18	My 2 Cents has a good point. IHC shirts are not to be sold (or given/donated) to the public, NO MATTER WHAT!. I too would rather donate money instead of my shirt. I am sure most IHC members feel this way as well. SLN
04/18	Rowdy, you have raised a sensitive issue about selling IHC shirts on the open market. The idea of a fund raiser for scholarships or a welfare fund is as good as any. However I don't think the general public has any cause to possess crew shirts. The privilege to possess an IHC shirt is earned through hard work and sacrifice. They are not a commodity to be traded for any (no matter how worthy) purpose. You were presented the shirts from the crews on the presumption that they would be used as a display at NIFC or some appropriate place that would give the shirts the respect that they are due. Please keep the crew shirts off the market, if you cannot work the display thing out at NIFC maybe the Boise or Idaho City Shots can get it done since they are close. I would be glad to donate a higher than market price of a crew shirt to a IHC welfare fund or scholarship fund if it would help keep the shirts available for their original intention. My 2 Cents.
04/18	Michael, You should try Wesco boots. I've worn this brand for years and find them to be terrific. Just broke down and got a new pair of Firestormers on sale. Breaking them in now. You should check em out. I think they're on sale thru the end of the month. Todd
04/18	From Firescribe: Fire Rages in Pike National Forest
04/18	Not long ago there was talk about an up and coming program on Nova. Which had something to do with the Arrowhead Hot Shots. Does anyone have any info on when it will be aired? R6FF May 7. Look here NOVA Fire Wars. Ab.
04/18	Cap Emmett I heard that when a cooperator calls re an IA fire originating in their jurisdiction, we will limit what we send for free. I know CDF is facing budget cuts, but this doesn't help our relationship with our cooperators and getting the fire out to be dickering over what's for free and what's not. Pretty soon they're going to do the same with us and we'll be there figuring costs while the fire rages on. AL
04/18	What rumors are those, Al? Please be specific, maybe us CDF’ers can lay your fears to rest. We are facing a $20 million budget cut, but I don’t think we are cutting engine companies or closing stations, if that’s what you heard. Captain Emmett
04/18	Help!! I need a good pair of boots, I have info on Nicks boots and Whites. Both look the same. Which is better, and how is the lace to toe? Is it better or worse? why? Thank you BE SAFE Michael
04/18	Smitty: "Just reading an old book dated 1966, "Principles of Forest Fire Management by Char and Chatten (no pun intended I'm sure) " The correct citation is Principles of Forest Fire Management by Clar and Chatten. Ray Clar was a venerable CDF firefighter and the primary historian of CDF and there has never been a better book written on fire management. Never. Capt 80
04/17	Any one know anything about getting a type 6 engine contracted with region 4? Thanks for the help in advance... AJM
04/17	Does anyone know whats up with CDF scaling back on the types of resources that will be available for free on IA? Lots of rumors out there... Has this been spelled out anywhere? AL
04/17	Lo ab, mellie, et al. BC we'll be staffing our winny office may 15. Reno and SLC around then too. Looks to be a ripping season, (course everyone says that this time of year;)) anyways hope to cross paths with you. Meredith congrats on getting a position so close to home! see you in Elko eric PW
04/16	I have a large collection of IHC t-shirts, probably the largest in the US. What does anyone out there think its worth? I started the collection some years ago and have them boxed up. Some new, some used and some you cant find anymore. Thoughts are to sell the collection and give the proceeds to a IHC crew member for a scholarship. I also know of a IHC-Superintendent going through a real battle with cancer, I would gladly try to finish the collection and sell it with proceeds going to his family. He is a great friend and I would like to help out. I know if it were for a benefit it may be worth more. Any ideas on how to market this collection? Maybe on ebay?  Rowdy
04/16	Jackson Rookie I am a wildland firefighter in Nevada and have worked with Jackson quite a bit. They are a very good crew. Lamar runs a great program over there. I had a buddy that detailed over there and he had a wonderful time. You're in good hands. NV Driptorch
04/16	CR- i don't know about the rest of the west but we had a hell of a storm here in SLC yesterday. knocked power out and rained mud and the wind was blowing trees over. turning out to be a good start..... SP
04/16	Hello, just found out about this site a few weeks ago and have enjoyed reading they said it. This is my first time writing in. Just wanted to let you know we've got a 100+ acre fire in the Dixie NF near Parowan, UT. They think it started with a lightning strike last Fri and grew with the winds yesterday. They're calling up some additional crews asap. Maybe some of you will come. The woods are tender dry. Be Safe, CR
04/16	Hi Ab, I'm a college student and have applied to work as a wildland fire fighter this summer, I have always wanted to do this, and have applied with several  different agencies for the summer 02' fire season. I've been told that a good way to land a fire fighting job is to be persistent, so I've tried to do that, and I check your site a lot for new job openings and think its really great! Anyways, I called a Forest Service Ranger District at Bighorn Nat'l Forest in WY and was told they don't know when they'll be able to start hiring, one person told me they thought they were having problems with the budget, is this true with all Forest Service Districts? Are they all having a hard time going through the hiring process? I have been waiting a while now and call every once in a while but haven't heard much from any other places I've applied to either. I am an Illinois Certified EMT-B, but am taking the National Registry exam in May, and have been a cadet on my local fire dept. for several years and becoming a wildland fire fighter is something I have always really wanted to do, as you can probably imagine, in Illinois we don't get too many wildfires though. If you or anyone has any advice for this fire fighter hopeful I would greatly appreciate it! Thanks a lot! Hope everyone has a safe season! BW Some places in CA are making temp offers now. Some FS Ranger Districts in northern CA are still sending out letters to people who worked last year and won't make new offers until they hear back from those folks, maybe in 2 weeks. Readers, anyone know about elsewhere across the US or about other agencies? Ab.
04/16	Here's what I've found out about the lookout question on IMWTK. Q: Were early lookouts mostly women and, of them, which one might be considered the most "stylish"? (Tongue firmly in cheek!)  A: One of the earliest and most stylish women lookouts has to be Helen Dow who "manned" Devil's Head Lookout in Colorado's Pike NF during most of the 1920's. Lookouts might see no one for long periods of time but could look across the forests below and see towers of other lookouts that might be as much as a hundred miles away. During World War II, many lookouts in Idaho and elsewhere in the west were staffed by young men, many not much more than boys (16 yr old). One such story is that of Warren Yahr who describes his experiences in Smoke Chaser. He describes talking nightly with other young lookouts whose lights he could see on distant mountaintops after dusk on the partyline phone. Cheryl PS Ab, please a